Alaysia Brown: So let's go ahead and get started. Like I mentioned, I am Alicia Brown, community lead. I diversify by design and I am so excited to be hosting tonight's Ask Me Anything conversation with Liz at. Now I just mentioned Diversify by Design. Also known as D by D, and some of you may know a ton about D by D, while some of you may know nothing about the coalition and are only here for Liz and I totally get that.

Alaysia Brown: But while I have you, I would love to tell you more about the coalition and why we even decided to develop an Amy series. So diversify by Design is a coalition of organizations and individuals that join forces in 2021 to create a more racially diverse and inclusive design industry. One of our critical goals is to create opportunities for historically excluded young people to learn about, design and connect with successful designers.

Alaysia Brown: And in that spirit, Divides Amy series was developed. The D by D Amy series serves as a platform for designers who champion diversity, equity, inclusion and belonging. To answer questions about their career, their professional, trajectory, what they did in undergrad, if they didn't go to undergrad, their life experience, and just in general, all the things that they've dedicated their careers to building.

Alaysia Brown: And with that, we are super excited to welcome you to tonight's AMA featuring Liz Art president at three Spot. A little bit more. About Liz. Like I mentioned, she's the president of Three Spot, a creative agency, a mission driven digital agency. That is behind campaigns for Planned Parenthood. The Trevor Project, and the Pulitzer Center.

Alaysia Brown: She's also a long time ag community leader and a former president of AIG. But what makes Liz's story special isn't just her title. Even though we love that, it's how she got there. So if you did not know Liz studied psychology and economics. She also designed for the campus theater to get more into that. She said yes to leadership roles.

Alaysia Brown: She didn't know if she was 100% writing for. And she built a career by leading with curiosity, not just certainty, which I know a lot of us probably try to do. So we're excited to hear from you, Liz. We're excited to hear what you've learned along the way. So welcome, Liz. Thank you for joining our AMA. If you're at home doing a little hand clap, clap, clap for you.

Liz Ott: Thank you.

Alaysia Brown: Yes. Liz, how does it feel to ask people, how does it feel hearing their bio back? Because people are like, yeah, you know, just a little career. And I'm like, look at all the cool stuff you've done.

Liz Ott: I still feel when I read it that I'm like, who are you talking about? That's not me. What do.

Alaysia Brown: You want?

Alaysia Brown: Only Liz.

Liz Ott: So great to be here.

Alaysia Brown: Yeah, that's. Well, we're excited to have you. And we've prepared a lot for this conversation. And I'm interested just to get an idea of who's in the room with us. I we mentioned this at the beginning, and I'm going to mention it one more time. I'd love to hear. We'd love to hear one word that describes where you are creatively right now.

Alaysia Brown: We've heard words all the way from excited to stifled. And I'm just curious as to where people are in their careers. Feel free to drop that in the chat if you'd like as well. Because, Liz, when we were preparing for this conversation, I was letting you know that so many people that join us are kind of like, am I doing this thing right?

Alaysia Brown: And anytime we have people speak, they're like, you're doing your thing, right? And all of our thing is different. And so, just excited to have you here. And with that, like I said, I would love to hear more in the chat. I'm going to jump into things. So a lot of the conversation that we had in preparation for this, we were talking about things kind of being like on the beaten path.

Alaysia Brown: I don't know if I made that thing up or if it is a saying, but I'll just kick off by saying you didn't take the expected, post-grad path. How did following what energized you shape your early career?

Liz Ott: Yeah, I think, I talk a lot about early on, not really knowing what the expected path was because I wasn't a person that I said, I want to be this or I want to be that. And, so in that I, had things that I liked and things that I did, and that ultimately shaped my career, I think, through the end, right through where I am now at least.

Liz Ott: I was studying econ in college and then, but really loved doing design and design for a theater when I was there. And so when I graduated, unlike the rest of the people that went to do consulting in either San Fran or New York, which felt like the normal path for a lot of people in my school, I was like, I'm going to be a designer, and I had no idea if I could do it or what that looked like.

Liz Ott: But I found a job doing kind of corporate branding and learned a lot on the job. And so in that, I think my path was a little bit of, what do I like to do? What energizes me, as you mentioned, what excites me. And, followed that. And I think I really always appreciated the amount that I needed, the creative energy and the work that I was doing, but also didn't go to school for design.

Liz Ott: It wasn't something that I learned by trade. So I always felt a little bit like I was straddling a line in that. So I, I, yeah, I think what felt most natural to me was really looking at what I liked. And then from that point on, every position that I chose or every move that I made was based on what more I needed, as opposed to kind of issues or problems that I was facing.

Alaysia Brown: Yeah.

Alaysia Brown: One question based off of what you just mentioned, you are not a designer by trade. You mentioned that you majored in econ. That's right.

Liz Ott: Yeah. You kind of psychology.

Alaysia Brown: Yes. Econ and psychology is your major. I'm sure there were moments when you started working those design jobs where you're like, this isn't my first trade. I didn't learn this firsthand in undergraduate. Was there a time where you were like, wait a second, I didn't feel imposter syndrome and doing this project and tackling this project personally, I also did not.

Alaysia Brown: The things that I do now, I didn't major in, and I find myself a lot of the times feeling like.

Alaysia Brown: Does anybody know that I didn't learn this in undergrad?

Alaysia Brown: Or I'm writing or typing and I'm like, somebody is going to come get me and they're going to say, you did not do this in undergrad. And I always wonder if it's that feeling going to go away one day. And I'm not sure if anyone on the call can identify with that, where maybe your first love is not something that you majored in, and you have that feeling of trepidation like you're, you know, imposter syndrome.

Alaysia Brown: So I wonder, did that ever go away for you? And if so, when?

Liz Ott: I mean, honestly, I feel like imposter syndrome hits me on the regular for different things. So I it's I think I more learned to embrace I don't know if it's imposter syndrome, but like, I remember early on somebody saying to me when I had a speaking engagement being like, are you nervous? And I was like, yeah, I can't believe I'm getting up in front of all of these people.

Liz Ott: And they were like, that's never going to leave you. And there was comfort that I found in that, that it wasn't that I'm not good at it or not. Meant to be doing it. It was just more that's a feeling. That's okay. And just embrace it. That that you're going to feel uncomfortable going into it. And, but that doesn't mean you're not going to do a good job.

Liz Ott: And so I relate that to the imposter syndrome idea with design. Like to me, it wasn't like I wasn't hiding that from anybody and saying that I didn't go to design school. And if anything, it was more of, I measured myself more on the value of the work that I was doing and how successful I was in it.

Liz Ott: And wasn't trying to be something that I wasn't, I guess, or wasn't trying to posture as something that I wasn't.

Alaysia Brown: Absolutely, I love that. One other question you've said never turned down a leadership opportunity. That scares me hearing that, because it never is a big word. And so now the next time I get offered something, Liz, that never turned down a leadership opportunity. So you said never turned down a leadership opportunity. Can you tell us about a time you almost did and what happened?

Liz Ott: Well, to be fair, my mom told me never turn down a leadership opportunity. And I took that advice quite many times in my life. There are certain there's certain value in saying no at times, but I think what that meant to me and where specifically it applied is, you know, I, with it when I first got involved in a IGA, which was early on when I was trying to figure out what was next and actually really trying to get connected with a creative community.

Liz Ott: In the DC area, I met a couple different people and started planning events and got involved. And fast forward a year or two, they were asking me to be, the current the current president at the time asked me to be the next incoming president, and I truly felt like I had no experience doing that. I, I laughed, I truly laughed, I was like, you're kidding.

Liz Ott: You're not what? And I had just started working, at three spot. At the time. It was a new job. It was stressful to me, the amount of work I had there. And so the idea of taking on something else on top of it felt pretty overwhelming. And I remember talking it through with a bunch of people, which is what I do.

Liz Ott: I go to my council of people to kind of process and discuss. And, that was when my mom was like, you know, I think in life you don't turn down leadership opportunities. And I really thought about it and I was, you know, for whatever reason, they thought I was the right person for the job. Again, similar to the imposter syndrome, I talked about what I, I mean, I was like, are you sure?

Liz Ott: I don't know, and they're like, yes, you can, you can do this. Like, this is you can do this. And so, yeah, I was full of fears. I had lots of things that I was concerned about, but I, said yes. And as a result of it, I think I got the I. I'm convinced that that experience got I got the best leadership experience doing because it was more of a volunteer position than, paid position.

Liz Ott: And so you have more freedom to set boundaries and do what you can do and push and invest the amount of time you need to. And so, I got great experience in it. I'm sure there's many things looking back that I could have and should have and what I've done differently, but I learned so much from it, and I think it helped position me for additional leadership opportunities.

Liz Ott: So I think the idea being just, don't let kind of, fear or limitations kind of hold you back from it. Because I think ultimately there's a lot of opportunity that can come from those different opportunities.

Alaysia Brown: Absolutely. And as you're talking, it also sounds like a lesson in trusting your tribe. You said that you went and you spoke to the people around you. Number one, someone was like, I see this in you. And so you're like, you see what? And they're like, I see you as president. And so it sounds like you, you know, you trusted whatever they saw.

Alaysia Brown: And then you talked to your mom, someone else who is a part of your tribe. And she's like, I say, never turn down a leadership opportunity. And it sounds like you trusted her. So I don't know about everyone else's here, but a lesson that I just gained from what you said is trust your tribe. Trust the people that you keep close.

Alaysia Brown: Because a lot of the times they may see something you don't see.

Liz Ott: Totally. And I think I have, I 100% rely on my tribe and my community, and I feel like I have, people that I rely on for different areas of life and different things that are, I'm equally excited to hear what they have that they're processing and offer my opinion whether they like it or not. But also, listen to what they have to share on that front.

Liz Ott: Because, you know, it matters. But I think also, as I've gotten older, I've learned to also trust my own instinct on things, too. And I think when I was younger that that's take that still takes work and muscle to build in terms of, I like to hear from people, but also process it along and not let it sway what where you're coming from.

Liz Ott: And so finding that balance of that, I think, is something that I'm always working on still.

Alaysia Brown: To this day.

Alaysia Brown: Yeah. And it sounds like you mentioned in the chat, I've learned to accept that. I know more than I think I know that's a message. Yes to that. And that others aren't usually judging me. The pressure is my own. And that is so true. So thank you for adding that comment. And just to the point of community list, because you just brought that up, especially in regards to Aiga.

Alaysia Brown: If we're on this call together. Matt Owen, Laura Jadah Jamie, if we're on this call, this is an opportunity to be in community. So don't be shy. You join the Ask Me Anything because you made me have a question. So drop it in the chat. Come off of mute. Enter into the conversation. This isn't just a conversation between myself and Liz, although I have lots of questions, but I think you're curious.

Alaysia Brown: I think it's a conversation between all of us. So even if you don't have, a question, but you have a comment, something that resonates, we'd love to hear from you because that's really how you build, community. Also, don't slip on dropping your LinkedIn profile. In the chat. You might see someone cool that you online. You dropped your LinkedIn and you never know.

Alaysia Brown: So just want to encourage everyone, in that way as well. But I'll keep us moving along. Liz, you've held roles across design, branding, and business. How did you learn to lead before you felt fully ready? Especially in those, like, very different ways. It seems.

Liz Ott: How did I learn to lead? I think that I learned to lead really by, just doing. I learn by doing and not. I mean, similar to saying no to leadership opportunities. It's not letting fear prevent you from taking a step forward. Because fear can put blockers in the way for everything. And I think with taking on new roles,

Liz Ott: I think it was a little bit of that following what I needed more of. And I've always had that kind of creative side with wanting to, like, what's the plan? How are we going to get there? I am a planner at heart. Most of my friends will attest to that, that I like to know when and where, but I also am open to what that path looks like and how to get there.

Liz Ott: And so I always kind of pushed myself on either sides of, opportunities. And that way, and so I think when I would take on new responsibilities, it was really following a path of like, okay, I learned how to manage a project. That's great. But oh, boy, Diane's here to.

Alaysia Brown: Fix all the hecklers I can.

Liz Ott: And so, yeah, I would, I think I would hear, like I did project management. And in that I really was obsessed with at three spot when I started, I was obsessed with what all the creatives were doing at my job. Like I came from, imposter design background, where I learned branding and corporate branding on the job and really switched to the more strategic end of things because I felt like I wasn't a designer by trade at the time.

Liz Ott: And then I got there and I was like, these people are so impressive. So and so. I was completely, wanted to learn as much as I could from them. I wanted to learn as much from the work that they were doing. It wasn't enough for me just to be managing the projects. And so I think in that that helped to fuel wanting to take on more responsibility, wanting to be able to lead in other ways and only way for me to do that is to really learn by doing and continue on to take on new opportunities.

Alaysia Brown: Absolutely. And that's it's such a lesson and that I feel like I have a habit of over planning and it's like, just do it. You know, it's like, how am I going to get through my day? Let me write this long To-Do list. And it's like you spent 45 minutes on the to do list and zero minutes on the doing.

Alaysia Brown: So you really do learn by doing. And so one question that Jada asked and Jada, thank you for your question, Jada said, how do you overcome self-doubt when you don't have any work or opportunities available? Have you ever experienced that?

Liz Ott: Good question Jada. Self-doubt hits all the time. So I think first and foremost, keep pushing through, because and and know that everybody, even if they are in a position or not in a position, are looking for work or not looking for work, still have that self-doubt. I think one of the things I've done when I've been in positions where I don't have work or I'm looking for something new, is really lean in on community.

Liz Ott: And for me, I think, the more you're talking to people, that's part of why I joined Aiga when I first moved to DC, it was to really connect with people and hear what people are doing. And I'm a big believer and, and it's harder now that a lot of things are remote, but finding ways to talk to people and show up in, a real way, like, don't feel like you have to put on false airs in those conversations.

Liz Ott: Say, yeah, I've been doing this. This is what I want to be doing. This is what I think I'm good at. This is what I'm looking for, because it's in those conversations that you meet people and talk to people that, might be able to connect you to that next opportunity. So I think and those moments, I, I really try to lean into community and trying to meet people and connect with people.

Alaysia Brown: Absolutely. Jada, thank you for that question. And I'm just going to pause for a second now and ask, does anyone else have any questions so far to ask? Liz, just based on what you've heard already?

Alaysia Brown: I have one. So Liz, you mentioned, kind of following what it is that you need more of, and that kind of being the way that you're guided through your career. And I'm curious how you manage to clear out the noise of maybe those, like, expected pathways, like maybe being measured by your company's metrics or doing what's rewarded within a specific place, versus really honing into what it is that you're being called to do.

Alaysia Brown: Yeah. And yeah, I'll stop there.

Liz Ott: No. Good question. Mary.

Alaysia Brown: I.

Liz Ott: Think, in terms of my current position, I think I've been lucky in that it's a place that really does encourage, pushing you to, to do more in different directions. But I can say before that, I think a lot of it it wasn't necessarily on the job always because you have I would have my job that frankly, I needed, pay the bills and keep moving on whether I liked it or not.

Liz Ott: But I think that's part of where I tried to find spaces in other ways, whether it be, connecting with more creative people that are doing more of the things that you like to do, or hopping on conversations like this, or, I think that's where I would maybe push more. I'm trying to think, and it sometimes isn't directly in your path.

Liz Ott: I think it's more the work that I'm doing that I was doing always. It helped me to be like, oh, I'm so tired of creating reports that nobody looks at, you know? And in a way, I was kind of like, I would rather I, I, I like the analysis part of this, but I want to figure out a way to make these reports more useful.

Liz Ott: So it's it's that it's like, how can you turn some of those things into something that, maybe is of more value? And in that I think nobody's going to ask you in current positions, the I'm all for ask talk to people, talk to people that you're working and talk to your manager, your supervisor and say, hey, I was thinking about this, I, I'm, I'm doing these reports, but I just feel like nobody is actually reading them.

Liz Ott: What, it be possible for me to take a stab at doing it a different way, or that kind of thing. I think I early on became aware of the fact that just doing good work and getting noticed by it isn't going to happen. You have to ask, do you almost have to create your own path and ask for your own path?

Liz Ott: And so I think that's what that's what I would recommend. Does that answer your question for sure?

Alaysia Brown: Yeah. Thank you.

Liz Ott: Yeah, absolutely.

Alaysia Brown: Thank you, Madonna, for that question. Diane, all of these good questions, I don't know which one expert. I'm going to ask the second question that Diane dropped first. Diane says if you could go back in time and give your younger self one piece of advice, what would it be? I love that question.

Liz Ott: Oh, Diane, so many things. Now, I think that first of all, I'm a believer in the journey, and the journey does make you, where you need to be. So I try not to harp too much on regrets, but I think that I, I really do wish that I had more, that I did have less self-doubt, that I was more comfortable just moving forward because I think I masked it well and pushed forward.

Liz Ott: But I spent a lot of time worrying and, having self-doubt and discussing it. And honestly to what? To what end in a way. So I think just probably helped if I could look back and kind of having more of the perspective of having more perspective earlier on, and I don't know how to I don't know how to get that.

Liz Ott: I don't know how to bottle that up, other than go to go through it.

Alaysia Brown: That makes sense. I love that, and thank you for that question, Diane. I'm going to come back to your first one in a moment. But, just to ask Liz more questions, just about the the things in the work that you've done. When I read your bio, I mentioned organizations like The Trevor Project, Planned Parenthood, obviously super bold missions, super mission driven organizations.

Alaysia Brown: How do you connect creative work to real world impact, especially in the climate that we're in now, to where it's almost like.

Alaysia Brown: You.

Alaysia Brown: Want like everything that you put out to be like, how is this making impact? But but to go back to just the initial question, how do you connect creative work to real world impact?

Liz Ott: Get a team of really smart people and know, I think that that, a couple things. One, first and foremost, really making sure we're, when working with a team or a project or a client and a mission is understanding what our goal is and not making assumptions on that and getting as clear and specific on what we're trying to accomplish, in a way that we can keep pointing back to that, is important.

Liz Ott: I think we also spend a lot of time discussing what success looks like, because success looks like a lot of different things to different people, and the more that we can all align on that from the front, the better at the start, the better and revisit it throughout, honestly, because you find that that changes. But I think the biggest thing that is kind of the reality of the creative work is like the creative work, and meeting the goals of a mission is not always going to fill the mold of, like the flashiest, most exciting.

Liz Ott: Design. And to me, that doesn't mean it's not creative, but it it, you know, let's be honest, a lot of the work we're doing, especially now, budgets are smaller and tighter. And so it's about how to be effective and, smart with how we're using budgets to meet clients needs. And, so I think understanding where you need to focus, where you need to push, prioritizing throughout is a big part of like blending creative work and miss, meeting, client like making impact ultimately.

Alaysia Brown: Yeah. And it also as an individual, it seems like you're kind of doing that work or not kind of. I say you also you are doing that work, personally as a professional and being a part of advisory council is like the D by D advisory Council. All of the creative work that you've done over the years, whenever you come in to our meetings that we're in conversation about how to move priorities forward, I could hear the work that you've done in those other spaces coming through in your responses to us.

Alaysia Brown: So, would you say that that's the case or like, how do you feel about that as well?

Liz Ott: No, definitely. I mean, I think you're kind of all of that stuff to me is helping to feel open, to make an impact in other ways. So not just in the client work, but also in communities and through, through, missions of different organizations. So, absolutely, I think that, I mean, I think relationships are a big part of that.

Liz Ott: And the more you're connecting, having conversations, widening that, that ripple overall, as, as how really minds are moved.

Alaysia Brown: Absolutely. And it also just seems like it's a natural progression, like from I for president. So like advisory council member of divide, it's just feels like in different steps of your professional life, you're still prioritizing that community, that leadership in different ways. So that's awesome to see. And like I keep saying to everyone in the audience, this isn't just a leisure access, activities, anything, this is everyone ask is anything.

Alaysia Brown: So I'm going to pause, just to ask for those who are in the room. Is there anything that Liz has said so far that spoke to you specifically? I'd love to hear, about that.

Alaysia Brown: And if you've been at an Amy before, you know I'm not afraid of an awkward pause or an awkward silence.

Alaysia Brown: So.

Alaysia Brown: So, I'm going to continue throughout this conversation to ask for your comments or your questions. Let's see. Diane also asked, is it possible for her and her team to show impact in a way that honors both data and human stories? I love that, and I said that pretty fast. So I can ask again.

Liz Ott: No, I I'm looking at her question. I'm thinking, yes, it's possible. Absolutely. Diane. It's I think that's a lot of what the mission of the work we did with Trevor Project was it was, data dashboard, but it was, based on human stories and really trying to connect, connect in that way. And I think a lot of the work we do really is with really designing with users and human, human centered, ultimately.

Liz Ott: So really looking at, designing for their needs, designing against their challenges, and data drives a part of it. But really, I would say more, those stories are what is at the core of the work. A lot of the work that we do.

Alaysia Brown: Absolutely. And one question we received through registration, Kiara mosley, who actually is a super active member of our community, graduated today from Pratt. She got her master's. So she's not with us today because she's graduating. But she did, and UX research. But she did submit a question. And her question says, how did you determine you wanted to shift into your current role?

Alaysia Brown: And I'm excited to hear more about that as well, because you were already at three spot, and it seems like you grew into this role. So would love to hear more people hear president Creative Agency. And they're like, ooh, tell me more. But a lot goes into getting into that place and so would love to hear more about that journey.

Liz Ott: Yeah. I mean, I spoke a little bit about this at the start where, truthfully, so when I came to three spot initially I was a project manager, and so I, actually, I'm going to resign before even that because I had been, working. I started out doing corporate branding, early on, right out of college, and that was fully me saying, I'm not going to do consultant work and going to be, something different.

Liz Ott: I really like designing posters. I'm going to try to do it to date myself. At the time, it was Job Jacket, so you'd designs, you'd be given content, you'd design it, and then you'd hand it back, and then you'd get back and red lines all over it, and then you'd hand it back and it was like really tidy design practice that you'd leave it behind.

Liz Ott: And I'd go home at night and be like, oh, this is great. But I also really didn't like being at the end of the line. I didn't like the design at that. And that role was not involved in the strategic thinking, which is part of why I went back to school. And did, got a degree in marketing.

Liz Ott: At the time I was working at Johns Hopkins, which has helped me to, to be able to pay for it. So I was doing school and, working there at the time. But the goal at that time was I wanted to be more strategically involved in the work. And there I was working as like an independent. I was a designer in house and doing everything like doing logos, advising a development team, advising a development team, like just doing a bunch of random stuff that I did not have training and I was learning as I go and using my instincts.

Liz Ott: As best as I could. But at that time, I got involved in a IGA because I really wanted to learn from other designers and connect with the community and blah, blah, blah. And through that is where I met somebody that was working at three spot who was looking for a project manager. And I remember saying, hey, do you think I could do this job?

Liz Ott: And at the time he said to me, do you like the internet? And I was like, yes. And he's like, are you smart? And I was like, I think so. And he was like, I think you could do the job. And I was like, okay. And so I applied and got the job. But I swear, partially it's knowing people, it's having, you know, being able to talk to him about what really was involved in the job and whatnot.

Liz Ott: So my time at three spot, I did project management for a long time and all I as I was saying, I was learning from everybody on the team. I very quickly saw how much the design industry had changed, and how I was incredibly amazed by the work that the designers, the UX designers, the creative directors were doing.

Liz Ott: They were driving the strategy from beginning to end. They were not just being given a job jacket at the end of the process. And I was I was beholden to them. I was learning from them. On how we could better wrangle this process to ultimately meet the the client's goals. So I did that for a long time and really liked, hearing what a client was struggling with, like what their problem was and figuring out what, what we could do to meet their need and so that was business development that I got involved in.

Liz Ott: I really like putting together proposals and helping them to like, say, how we would solve their problems and what it would cost. And so I did that for a while. I actually went to the founders of the company and said, you need somebody to do this, like you're doing it, and it's disconnected from the work that we're actually doing.

Liz Ott: And so I pitched them on that position and they were like, okay. And so I did that for several years. And, you know, the agency went through lots of changes. And I think in that I like I was saying I continue to find areas to add value. I was doing more than just business development. I was interested in other areas.

Liz Ott: So I, you know, hated how we were doing time tracking. And I, like May, suggested a new system for doing that. So I like got involved in different ways. And so long story short, they ended up I was hitting a point where I was about to go to them and say, I feel like I've maxed out and reached my limit here, and don't, don't what?

Liz Ott: Are we going to put that out for them? Do they? Don't know that. But now.

Alaysia Brown: I've reached a.

Liz Ott: Point with that. And they came to me, right before and asked if I was interested and, talking about kind of transition plans for, for a three spot to move into president. So to me, I, I, I never would have even seen myself despite being president of AIG. I wasn't looking at taking on that role. It was as much a surprise to me.

Liz Ott: And looking back, I'm like, of course that makes sense. This is all the stuff I was doing that kind of put me to be in a good, the best, like best position for this role. But I think it was more that, that that aspect of like trying to add value in different ways and push beyond what a job description said, that ultimately positioned me to be in that place.

Alaysia Brown: Yes, Chris, I'm going to tag you in in a couple of minutes because I know you just gained so much from that response. So interested to hear your POV and your gems that you got from that. I don't know about everyone else here, but Liz, you just said so much. My favorite thing about hosting the like, so much good stuff.

Alaysia Brown: My favorite thing about hosting these AMAs is the speakers that we speak with. Come on. And they say the most powerful thing so nonchalantly. We've had someone like, yeah, I, I applied to Microsoft 12 times before I got the role. I'm like, that's huge. I thank you for saying that because now I know that when I don't get it, the first, the second, third, the fourth, I still have eight more times to try.

Alaysia Brown: And just now you said I went to the executives, I went to the founders. I don't want to misspeak, but you went to those at the top, and you were like, this is what you're not doing. The I can do it and that takes guts. That is okay in those roles. And I don't know if I speak for other people are here, but you probably see things going on within your company all the time, and you call your sister, or you call your friend, or you're talking to your coworker and you're like, they're not doing this, and they need to be doing that.

Alaysia Brown: And it stays as conversation between you and someone else when it all actuality you have the power to say, these are the things. How can I construct this in a productive way and present it to leaders? And so what empowered you to just do that? Did someone tell you to do it or were you just like the like it's amazing that you did that.

Liz Ott: I think that, first of all, I should add, there were many of times I've been at three spot for 16 years, but there were many times that I interviewed. I almost took positions elsewhere. I talked at other places. It's not to say that it's been 16 years of like, bliss.

Alaysia Brown: At,

Liz Ott: You know, like there's always going to be ups and downs and challenges. I think I, each of those times were moments that helped me to better refocus on what I needed and a lot of, a lot of my career has been guided by. Okay, well, this really sucked. I'm either leaving or I need to do something different and that is what fuels you.

Liz Ott: It's like I, I, I have I have a lot of loyalty to jobs that I'm in. I like the people, I like the team. I like the work. It's it's a big move to leave, positions. And I think in that I like to almost, I take that challenge of like, okay, well, this is what I want to do, and this is what I think makes sense.

Liz Ott: And if that doesn't work out, then that fuels me getting something else. And so I think that's where I came from. And also it's not an aggressive conversation. It's more like this is something I've been doing. I think I can add value. So yeah, I think I've had coaching. I've, I had a professional coach for a while that helped me with some of these conversations.

Liz Ott: I think having people to help shape and figure out the best way to pitch it, and those moments, of course, and knowing that it doesn't always work out, but also you're I think there's growth to come from just those conversations regardless.

Chris DeSantis: And it sounds like to me, Liz, your internal barometer is pretty spot on that you've cultivated that. This is what I like. This is what I need. I'm hearing I statements. It's not about what is external to you, it's how can I contribute. And benchmarking for yourself almost. And and I'm going to circle back to Diane's question about, you know, how do you keep yourself motivated in tough times?

Chris DeSantis: And an internal barometer. There's your answer.

Alaysia Brown: Often. Yeah. Yeah.

Chris DeSantis: To reflect back on your successes, take a actually, I had a conversation with a coworker about this, just yesterday. It's like, you know, you wrote this kick ass piece. Go back and read it when you're feeling not too good about what's going on around you. And, Yeah. And that's what that that's what I'm hearing from you, Liz.

Chris DeSantis: This internal barometer is, like, anchored and, you know, you and and what you want to strive for. And it sounds like you've cultivated not just your community that that you know, your tribe, that your your going to, but your intuition cultivating.

Liz Ott: Making it seem much more centered and clear than I feel like it ever has been.

Alaysia Brown: But of course.

Chris DeSantis: It doesn't feel like that when we're doing it.

Alaysia Brown: But that's how it shows up.

Liz Ott: Yeah. No. Right. Here's a piece of that. I think also, I've always, tried.

Liz Ott: Finding a way to escape and pull away from it. The more that you can not be in the weeds of whatever problem you're in, and turn off and go someplace else and then come back to it. Like, I really try not to act in those moments. And I think that's helps with that barometer and that, perspective to be able to pull back and say, you know what?

Liz Ott: It was really annoying that that was said to me, but also that has nothing to do with my job. That has to do with personal dynamics. And there's going to be personal dynamics a lot of places or whatever it might be, and being able to pull back and have some perspective helps you to kind of come back. And then when you come back and you're feeling that consistently, then yeah, it reinforces that internal barometer for sure.

Alaysia Brown: Absolutely. I'm going to ask this question that Nick's in the chat, but I do want to let everyone know that I will be coming back to the room. So if there are thoughts or questions that, you've thought about since I last acts, I encourage you, to, to build community, to be in conversation. So I'll come back to y'all.

Alaysia Brown: But for now, Nick asked, how do you balance creative vision with business strategy in your leadership role?

Liz Ott: So, how do I balance it? Me personally, I think it is like recognizing that there are that it's.

Liz Ott: I try to take both sides when I'm thinking about it. Like looking at one. What? That I talked earlier about what the goal of the project is. And oftentimes I don't think that they're at odds. I don't think they're necessarily two different things. The creative strategy versus the business strategy. But I do think it, it takes kind of looking at it from both sides and not just coming in with my instinct.

Liz Ott: It's very easy to go straight to dollars, but I oftentimes will like ask, you know, our director of creative strategy sometimes if I'm like stuck there being like, can you can we just talk about this for a minute? Because and so I, I mean, I'm obviously a person that conversation and discourse helps me to process. But I think, the more you can center on what the bigger vision is and make sure that you're taking into account both sides consistently, time and time again, checking back, checking back.

Liz Ott: Is is all it's there's always going to be tension between the two. That's I mean, we design our projects to have a producer and a creative director intentionally. So. And one is designed to break the budget and one is designed to keep them on budget and, and check back in on those business goals. And I think you need that to get to a successful solution.

Alaysia Brown: I love that break the budget and keep the budget between creative director and producer. That's awesome. And Diane actually followed up asking, how has your leadership style evolved over time? And I'm really interested to hear that too.

Liz Ott: I think that, well, as you've probably heard, I am, a people person and always have been. I think one of the biggest areas is acknowledging that being a good leader isn't just about making people happy. And that there's the, kind of aligning more on what the goal is and getting people more aligned on what the vision and goal is.

Liz Ott: And the purpose, sometimes results with people not being happy. And I and I guess, learning to be okay with that. It still sucks. I still don't like, I want people to like me. But I think that is probably the biggest way where my leadership has evolved, acknowledging that without having those hard conversations and being able to talk about them.

Liz Ott: And I in a way that, again, really centers us on what the purpose and the goal is. Then ultimately you're kind of doing a disservice to the work and to the people, and their ability to grow. So, I think that's how I've evolved as I'm evolving.

Alaysia Brown: Yes, I love that I am. Thank you for all of these good questions. We we love them. And just as a reminder to our audience, time is dwindling down. I cannot believe we've been talking for 15 minutes. It feels like 15. So definitely get those last minute questions and drop them in the chat. Come off of mute.

Alaysia Brown: Laura, I love this question that you asked. Laura asked, and if I'm mispronouncing your name, please come off of mute and correct me. How did you best highlight? How did you best highlight your transferable skills when making career pivots, especially earlier in your career?

Liz Ott: Well, I think that my my, How did I highlight, I think that that's been a skill that was definitely a skill early on of, like, what to pull out.

Alaysia Brown: That I don't I'm not I'm not.

Liz Ott: Lying, Diane. I'm trying to think of what I did. How can I be lying when I didn't answer the question yet? I. Okay. So I think there's always the feeling, the job skills, like, there's the checking the box. I think what stands out is what what other things you did. So I'm trying to think I remember my, my first job, I was a presentation publisher.

Liz Ott: So I was like making people presentation pens for sales. Guys, truly, mostly men that were going on the road and talking about products. It was corporate. It was corporate. A financial industry. And I was creating these presentation PowerPoint decks and, and going with them. And it wasn't pretty mind numbing a lot of the time, except for there were lots of perks.

Liz Ott: I got to travel, I got to go to these professional settings and see how it worked. I had to be able to quickly learn how to do things to get them ready. So I felt like that was an area that was valuable that I was learning. On top of that, it drove me crazy how, how disorganized it was.

Liz Ott: And it was impossible to find artwork and images and assets to support the PowerPoint. So we weren't supposed to use clip art, which is what people did at the time, but it was how do you find these assets? And one of the things I did early on was organized a file system for all of the assets. And I remember that being something that I was like, oh, well, that's actually something outside of that wasn't something in my job description, but it was something that helped everybody do better.

Liz Ott: So I think the more you're doing work and you can think about things that you can be doing to, create, make things better, that I think those are the skills that are worth highlighting and thinking about. Does that answer your question, Laura? Diane, am I lying?

Alaysia Brown: I, Diane and Liz are my my new favorite.

Alaysia Brown: Well, I.

Liz Ott: Don't let Tina get in there because.

Alaysia Brown: And Laura says yes, thank you. I love that. And Tina also asks, how would your team described you? Describe you?

Liz Ott: That's evolved over the time, too. I think that people would describe me as, warm. I think that, they would describe me. It's funny, as I have gotten into positions, I'm surprised, especially in the remote world, how much?

Liz Ott: You. That warmth is easy to get lost. And, it's easy to just become a title and a role. And so I think there was a period of time that people would be like, she's the man. Like, literally there was a moment where I was like, when did I become the man? Like, when did I become this person?

Liz Ott: That's just not considering what's going on. But I think and I don't think people would actually describe me as that. But it's easy to feel that way in a remote world and a position like that when you're not able to, like, find the time and space to talk to people. And that's hard to do. And, remote agency with lots of people.

Liz Ott: So, I try to find a balance in that right of being clear and what the goal is unclear on what the purpose. But also, warm and myself and bringing who I am, like, I really don't want to be a postured leader. I want to be what you're seeing here. And so that's something that I think I try to find a balance of.

Liz Ott: And most people would describe me kind, clear in the vision, able to kind of a lot of people talk about that. I am a good person that come to present different perspectives, because oftentimes that is my way of like, well, I want you to think about it this way. And so I think that is value that I bring to them.

Liz Ott: And they bring up.

Alaysia Brown: Yeah. And then I, I'm going to ask this last question and we are going to wrap things up. So Jada acts as someone who runs an agency from that perspective. What kind of designer? What kind of designer do you look for when hiring? When building up three Spot as an agency, what kinds of people do you surround yourself with and like to work with?

Liz Ott: When I need to catch up on as these guys. Okay, so are we doing Tina Question or Jada.

Alaysia Brown: On Jada's question right now? Okay. And Jada says, as someone who runs an agency, what kind of designer do you look for when hiring when building up Three spot as an agency? What kinds of people do you surround yourself with and like to work with?

Liz Ott: Some question. Jada. I think that, we.

Alaysia Brown: For designers.

Liz Ott: For designers. I think we're looking for people that can speak to their work and can bring, the thinking behind it. It's not just about, it's not just about what you've created, but also the story you can tell with it and and the thinking that goes behind it. And what type of team, what are we looking for and what kind of people?

Liz Ott: I think people that are curious, people that are bringing different perspectives and kind of their full selves to the conversation and, people that care about the integrity of their work and, pay attention to those kind of details and are willing to kind of ask the questions that they need to to force everyone around them to be better.

Liz Ott: I think that's one of the things that we look for most are we don't suffer fools like we are going to ask the questions, we are going to work together and we're good, nice. And it's all constructive. It's all productive. But we want to make sure that we're asking the right questions. And that's something that I think we look for in people.

Liz Ott: People with that curiosity and that hunger to do more and understand why and everything that they're making and doing.

Alaysia Brown: Absolutely. I love that. I love that a lot. So before we wrap up, I have a question. Go ahead.

Chris DeSantis: Chris, I wonder if we could get to Tina's question really quick.

Alaysia Brown: Let's see. I completely missed this question. I'm sorry. The chat is moving so fast on my end. I didn't see that either.

Chris DeSantis: It's. What do you miss most from the days when you weren't a leader? When you were an individual contributor or maker? Do you miss that.

Alaysia Brown: Every.

Liz Ott: Single day?

Alaysia Brown: Yeah, every single day. Yeah. I mean.

Liz Ott: Yes, managing people is hard. It's not fun. Yeah. Having to make decisions about things sucks. Sometimes you just want to be told what to do. And I wish that I could. I wish that I could be given something and just go and work and collaborate and solve problems and then leave and come back and not. And and guess what?

Liz Ott: To be clear, when I was doing that, I still stressed about everything that I was doing then. But now, as Diane asked me earlier, what would I do on my younger self? I'd have that perspective. But yeah, a lot of times I miss that. I'm I mean, right now I'm less connected to the clients and the work that we do.

Liz Ott: I'm more removed from it. That's something that I deeply miss and I miss being a part of the work. Very.

Chris DeSantis: And then then she asks part two Liz, and how do you help individual contributors who want to become people managers transition into leadership?

Liz Ott: That's something we've been doing a lot, thinking a lot about and what that looks like. And we've done a lot in the past couple of years to really map out career ladders. Now, with that said, there's a balance in this, like, we've mapped out what the levels are and what some of those skills are, but we also in that are pushing people to like, think of other areas to add value and thinking of other areas and not and encouraging them to ask those, questions.

Liz Ott: So I think one helping to clarify what a path a, maybe more normal path looks like, but also really trying to tap into what people's unique and see what their unique skills are and how that can kind of be channeled are some of the areas that I'm trying to keep an eye out for.

Alaysia Brown: I love that, and Tina, thank you for that question. I honestly wish we could keep talking because I love hearing from your your point of view. Liz, I, like I said, you're so nonchalant about the coolest things ever, and your perspective is just so valuable. So we really appreciate you participating in this, Amy, to everyone who attended, thank you so much for attending and we hope that you'll continue to attend our Amy's.

Alaysia Brown: We actually have an AMA. This is our last one for, I guess pre summer in May. Our next AMA is not until July. August. Actually, I just dropped the link August 27th, and it's with Owen Hammons. Owen is an experiential design executive with 20 years of design experience. Design thinking, leadership, visual design, leadership. And he works at the intersection of design and business.

Alaysia Brown: So super excited. I just dropped the registration link. We hope you'll join us. And one more question for you all. Before we wrap, I want everyone, just to have a moment of reflection. And so in the chat, I would love if you could drop one word or phrase you're taking with you from tonight's conversation. I'm going to think of mine.

Alaysia Brown: I hope you think of yours. One more time, I'll ask. Drop one word or phrase you're taking with you from tonight's conversation. I think mine would be intuition and trusting like that intuitive, you know, just being that you feel your gut, so I. It sounds like you've done that many times, Liz. And like you said, it all has not been roses and daisies, but, one line that I've, I've felt continuously in your story is just kind of you trusting yourself.

Alaysia Brown: And so I'm going to trust myself. And this is said forge new paths. Jada said be comfortable moving forward, keep pushing and go through it. Yes, Jada. Jada, you're taking me to church.

Alaysia Brown: Kind of keep pushing.

Alaysia Brown: And go through it, Emily says. Trust, Lara says follow curiosities. And Diane said, invest in yourself. So I love all of these. I'm taking all of these with me. Like I mentioned, if you enjoyed our conversation tonight, go into the chat. Click that registration link. Register for our next AMA. So it's already in your calendar come August.

Alaysia Brown: And Diane, how can we remain in touch with you on LinkedIn? Instagram? What's your thing.

Liz Ott: Diane or me?

Alaysia Brown: Liz, start. Oh, Diane's going to love that. Diane. You know who that's is.

Alaysia Brown: Sign that we need you on our next AMA. If you all don't know, Diane is also an amazing designer. Check out her LinkedIn. So her and Liz have been having a lot of fun. She's great. But my.

Chris DeSantis: She's also on our advisory committee.

Alaysia Brown: And also on our advisory.

Liz Ott: This is about me, not Diane. Okay.

Alaysia Brown: See, you have to edit this out. Take you.

Alaysia Brown: Take to.

Alaysia Brown: Live. Where can we follow you?

Liz Ott: You can follow me on LinkedIn or Instagram. I know, on, and. Yeah. Happy. If anybody wants to connect directly, answer any other questions, and, support in any way.

Alaysia Brown: Yes. And, Tina, your word is evolving. I love that to your side to add that, and you can follow diversify by design on Instagram and Text Coalition. You also can follow diversify by design. Just search, Diversify by design on LinkedIn will pop up. Follow us. That way you can remain up to date with any blogs, articles we put out, more AMA content and just more community things that we plan to do throughout the next year or this year.

Alaysia Brown: I should say. So. Thank you again everyone, for taking time to be with us, remain as a member of this community. Keep coming back. And just again, thank you, Liz.

Liz Ott: Thank you. Thank you all.

Alaysia Brown: For thank you.

Chris DeSantis: This this was awesome. And thank you all for coming.

Alaysia Brown: Yeah. It's awesome. All righty. Talk to you later.

Alaysia Brown: Thanks. Thank you. Thank you everyone.

Alaysia Brown: Thank you. Problem. Thank you.